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Monday, March 22, 2010

Stark Tells Colleagues He is Using Oxygen Tube

SAYS HIS HEALTH IS IMPROVING; DOES NOT SPEAK ON HEALTH REFORM LAST NIGHT 
The headline in yesterday's Roll Call says "Stark Says His Health is Improving," but not enough to appear before the House Sunday night in what was likely the most historic vote of Rep. Pete Stark's long career in Washington.

According to Roll Call, the newspaper of Capitol Hill, Stark sent a note last Saturday to his congressional colleagues saying he was returning to good health. “The good news is, that after months in the hospital last year, there is no more pneumonia. Unfortunately, my lung capacity was diminished and for a while I need to use supplemental oxygen to operate at 100%. So don’t panic if you see me with a little plastic tube at my nose. It’s a bit inconvenient, but it works,” wrote Stark.

Stark did not read his statement in support of the health care reform bill passed last night in the House into the record. Rep. Sander Levin (D-Mich.), instead, submitted the 78-year-old's statement into the record. Nationwide coverage of the floor debate across all cable news outlets would have been a rare opportunity for the congressmen who has made health care reform one of his signature issues, a chance to bask in the spotlight. On second thought, maybe not.

A reading of Stark's remarks in support of the bill is tempered in its enthusiasm in a way typical for Stark and his contrarian streak even when it comes to raining on his own party's parade.

"It isn’t the bill I would have written," the statement reads. "However when it comes to legislating health insurance reform in America, we will not get everything each of us want.  This bill is a compromise that bridges the differences among us." This is hardly what House Speaker Nancy Pelosi would want broadcasted to the millions of viewers watching across the country, but why did Stark miss his chance to grandstand?

Was it the oxygen tubes he alluded to in his statement this weekend to House Democrats or is his health worse than his constituents are being led to believe? Stark was believed to had been fighting the effects of pneumonia for the most part of last year. He appeared before his constituents in September and October for town hall meetings targeted by Tea Party supporters and looked in reasonably good health as he chatted about the proper use of urine with a resident in Fremont. At subsequent public appearances, he walked with a pronounced limp and had trouble hearing, but his speech sounded loud and robust. 

With news of Stark relying on a breathing tube to perform his duties--he has the fifth-worst attendance record in the House--there may be justifiable concern whether his health is actually improving from last year bout with pneumonia or not.
-STEVEN TAVARES
JOIN THE REVOLUTION! for more news, go to twitter.com/eastbaycitizen 

71 comments :

Pete was healthy enough to be with the House Caucus leadership after Midnight EST at their post-vote celebration/press conference.

Many, many people in Stark's District agreed with his view that there was not as much reform as preferred. Polls which asked people if they supported the reform bill approved by the House yesterday were analyzed as if all people in opposition to reform opposed it from the right; in fact, many opposed it from the left.

In addition, months of despicable lies about the bills have had their effect. When people were asked if they supported the major elements that are actually in the bill, the popularity of the reforms are much higher. Public approval of the full reform package is dragged down by many things, most of which are not in the bill which will become law this week. "Death panels" are among the most notorious of these. These will be discovered as falsehoods when the law is implemented.

Are you insane? Who the hell supported this idiotic bill? A bunch of pop smoking aging hippies and some old retired workers from Alameda and Oakland Army Base who sat on their butts for 30 years. Stark is a disgrace, this socialist bill is anti-Constitutional, both need to be run out of town. He's a pig and a RED!

I agree with this article. The facts are all there to put together. The guy is in bad health. He doesn't show up for votes and now he has a breathing tube. Put two and two together and he wife endorsed Nadia Lockyer for supervisor. That should tell you who comes after Pete.

Pete Stark doesn't give a rats-ass about his Congressional district. If he did, he'd live here, if he did, he'd show up to work, if he did, he'd listen to the word "CHANGE" and not run for office anymore. The Dems & Unions that pay him to "serve" us need to wake up and find a better representative; a TRUE Democrat, not some progressive old fart stuck in the 70s.

I failed to mention...you can hear Mary Hayashi and EVERY other union owned liar, foaming at the mouth on this one; they can't wait for the old man to give-in!

This pig is an oxygen thief anyway. For 40 DAMN years this county has had no Representative in Congress because this waste of space has been collecting a paycheck. Get the hell out of Congress.

I don't think Congressperson Stark is a Communist. It would be unfair to call him one. We had many many communists elected leaders in the unions before the Cold War , when labor was according to experts was "on the move."Although we generally are very negative about Catholic priest pedophiles , they played a central role in the purge of leftist labor leaders and some say the demise of workers in general.They were like the Tea Party in Macartyism.
Conservatives are smart they use the government much better than liberals but don't call that socialism. The financial sector bail out was socialism on steroids , the military contractor's a socialism of fear and all those patriotic conservative manufacturers making it in China a communist lead country.Call it Conservative Patriotic Socialism and special thanks to the pedophiles.

Craig

Pete Stark is a socialist. http://www.commieblaster.com/progressives/

Note that these attacks against Stark, Democratic Party leaders and unions by anonymous commenters have no substance and many slurs.

Insane...idiotic...pop(?) smoking...disgrace...anti-Constitutional...pig...RED...old fart...liar...pig...oxygen thief...waste of space...

Who are the ones "foaming at the mouth"?

Claims that the health care reform laws violate the Constitution are particularly pathetic. In the end, these claims place our Tea Baggers in the same spot previously occupied by Southerners opposing school desegregation in the 1950's and '60's, with their cries of "Nullification!" and "Segregation forever!".

Liberals and progressives would like to have a rational, fact-based dialogue with conservatives about the challenges we face together. Statements like these are not representative of people who wish to work together, or representative of fact-based dialogue.

President Obama and Democratic Party Congressional candidates campaigned on passing reform; they won large majorities by doing so. I know what "representative democracy" means; do our anonymous commenters?

Dean Baker the economist is writing a book about how conservatives are the true socialists, what I think he calls "smart socialism." The suburbs of D.C. are filled with estates or near estates of conservatives who know how to work the system for all they can.
Believing that the government with its tremendous resources can do good for its people is apparently a bad thing according to right wingers. If people could get out of the high debt and the poor employment situation we are now in they wouldn't care if you called it capitalism, socialism or rheumatism . People need help.
Craig

Oh so it's ok to call patriotic American's who are part of the Tea Party "tea baggers" which is a sexual perversion, but since most libtards are into perversion I'm not surprised. Stark is a Communist through and through. He doesn't believe in GOD and is a socialist. That makes him a COMMUNIST and an oxygen thief. This piece of crap is as Anti-American as they come. A pox on the American people.

I'd like to shove that tank up his ass and explode it.

People who are not involved in issues tend to depict the opposition in angry aggressive terms. Sometimes Democrats and Republicans elected officials seem chummy because they work and personally know each other on a certain level.As in "my friend from the other party" Most people are not involved in politics so when they become involved a little and are part of groups that condones vulgarity and abusive dialogue , than you get what you get. I think it stems from the lack of contact between people of opposing perspectives.The lack of political involvement by the population in general. Of course there are a lot of campaign contributions coming from corporate America for votes against anything progressive.
Conservatives may love America.I don't believe it is any greater than how progressives love America but conservative leaders and corporations have betrayed America and their followers .Your lover is cheating on you.

Craig

Elaborate. How have corporations betrayed America?

Many corporations have spent billions of dollars to elect and lobby our local, State and particularly Federal elected officials for decades in order to gain deregulation and lax regulation of large portions of our economy. From the S & L scandals of the 80's to the massive loss of manufacturing jobs brought on by NAFTA and other trade agreements in the 90's to Enron's abuses in the early part of the century, the greed and unsustainable business practices of many corporations and related businesses have brought on crisis after crisis, all covered by American taxpayers.

The most recent disastrous outcome, brought on by massive deregulation of financial institutions, has placed us in America's deepest financial crisis since the Great Depression. The greed and shortsightedness of many corporations has also been a large factor in the current, growing imbalance between the few megarich, America's rapidly shrinking middle class and growing ranks of the poor. This imbalance is both financially and socially unsustainable absent the implementation of a security state.

Enter the "Patriot Act", the wholesale breaking of privacy and civil rights laws even outside the Act, the Bush Doctrine and its advocacy for nonstop war, the breaking of the historical American opposition to torture and the normalization of torture through the improper use of tazers and other instruments and practices, the constant efforts to evade the reasonable restraits of habeas corpus....these are all betrayals of American ideals, betrayals almost always pushed by the politicians corporations support most. At this point, corporations have been financially rewarded for these amoral policies, and are as firmly in control of America as they ever have been. Today's America is, generally, the America that corporations want; I call that betrayal.

Bill Clinton recently conceded that NAFTA didn't deliver what it promised. He said this in regards to how Haitians were driven off the land where they produced rice to subsist and were forced to move to the cities.So many of these former rice farmers died in the earthquake. The same is true for Mexico where the farmers moved north to the United States because they lost their land because of NAFTA. If Clinton now ,in one of his favorite phrases "got it right"about NAFTA and agriculture what about the job situation in regards to the rosie NAFTA theory. The theory that we will create millions of high wage,high tech jobs and should let our industry move overseas did not prove correct in practice. Pundit economist predict based on BS that the situation will turn around in 2015 , as though they know what will happen in 5 months let alone 5 years. By the way we lost 32 to 38 million industrial jobs in the 70's.Corporate Ceo's most of whom are staunch conservatives have been cuttin' and running from America for decades.
Your best friend CEO's, Mr. Anonymous Conservative have been betraying you and your loved ones and America for years.

Craig

What a laughable argument. NAFTA caused Mexican farmers to lose their land???? What Marxist handbook did that load of manure come out of? Mexico is a corrupt backwards cesspool of ignornance. NAFTA caused Haitains to move to the cities? What fantasy island is that from? Haiti is a another corrupt island of ignorance. You liberals are quick to blame everyone but the real people at fault...the Mexicans and the Haitiains. You can only help an ignorant person so much and then they will just digress to the cavemen they were to begin with. The first step to wisdom is to admit that you're a fool and both the Mexicans and Haitians have yet to admit their foolishness.

The current economic crisis was caused by the government forcing banks to loan money to unqualified minorities. People who didn't have the income nor pride of ownership to buy a house. It was caused by greeding liberals who take land out of development in order to keep prices artificially high. Blame the people, not a nameless, faceless institution.

The anonymous sicko is a closet Nazi . Sixty percent of people who were sold adjustable rate mortgages qualified for fixed rate mortgages. Now all of us have taken a big hit because racist mortgage lenders made $5000 on an adjustable mortgage instead of about a $1000 on a fixed rate. Tell your right wing friends that some right wing racist mortgage lender "got over" on some minority home buyers but in the end also cost YOU a hundred or two hundred thousand. Plus they ruined the economy.Betrayed once again by one of your right wing friends.Come out of the closet sicko.

Craig

A Nazi would be the leftit scum who parade around Berkeley and San Francisco wanting to gut the Constitution and take away our liberties and freedom. You leftists can't hide your real agenda...destroying the American way of living. So take your hilariously stupid labeling and place it where it belongs; on International ANSWER, LA RAZA, ACORN and all the other hate groups of the Bay Area.

We took a hit in the taxpayer pockets because the GOVERNMENT forced banks to loan money to unworthy borrowers, pure and simple. Blame the people who took out the loans, not the institutions who were strong armed in the first place to make bad loans. 60% of the ARM loans were to people who qualified for fixed rate???? Hardly. Few people qualify for a fixed rate on a $500,000, $600,000 or more loan. Where do you sicko's get these figures? Oh yeah, as long as they sound good, that's all that matters. Like the Nazi's in Germany did, repeat a lie enough and soon the fools will believe it.

They made the loans because they were making money on the loans. A big Ponzi scheme. Ultimately , if we had real affordable housing like our economic competitors ,people wouldn't need to get in the home buyers market. Doubling peoples home mortgage, with a sum prime, when they are struggling to make ends meet if it could do excessive damage might be pro American by your standards but few people would agree with you.

Craig

What he hell do you mean by "real affordable housing like our economic competitors"???? Get the government out of the housing market and homes will become "affordable". That's why homes are bigger and less expensive in Texas than in California. Another shallow and ignorant leftist argument...affordable housing. It's not the governments responsibility to provide housing to every idle loafer in America.

Get the right wing out of housing . From the Savings and Loan scam that cost tax payers tens of billions to the sub prime Ponzi scheme which ruined the lives of millions and the home equity of everyone.Government should have its nose in housing, not just because there are so many scam artists but because we can't compete without affordable housing and affordable health care and transportation. Put then again business chases cheap labor like a junkie a fix.
Craig

What a laughable argument. What and how will the government keep housing "affordable"??? Competition will keep housing affordable. Price points will be met, vacancies will accumulate and prices will drop. Wow, what a novel concept; the free marketplace. However, since most liberals are on some type of drug; either prescribed or illegal (ganga, heroin, cocaine) that simple fact of life evades them. So they cry out; "big Daddy Government help me, I'm incompetent".

Affordable transportation? Surely you're not using that money pit of waste known as public transit (BART, SamTrans, AC Transit et al) as an example of necessity. Public transit was just another step towards fascism brought to us by the sons of Mussolini. Time to privatize BART.

Ask a manufacturer if affordable housing is important, why they move to a place like China. Few would agree with right wing ideologues . Cheaper labor costs , which come down to a lower cost of living, housing, health care and transportation.
Come out of the closet or are you privatized and need to hide your identity? Privatization only works when you slash labor costs. Lower police wages to $7.00 an hour And you would save millions for the city.
Craig

Why do manufacturer's move from California to Nevada, Arizona, Texas???? Wow; lower taxes, lower housing costs. Ask yourself why is housing so expensive in California, Massachusetts, New York, New Jersey, Connecticutt while people and businesses are fleeing?

You're obviously, like all liberals, an economic ignorant, privatization works because the private sector takes into account routes that are making money as opposed to routes that aren't making money. Privatization takes into account fares; if fares are too high, less people will ride. Privatization will weed out the corruption and loafers and bring about a more efficient system of public transportation.

Privatization is plunder, slashing pensions and wages, destroying the middle class. Privatization breeds poverty . Of all the developed countries in the world we are the most unequal and pay for it in many ways. The conservative ideology breeds the M&M coalition of millionaires and morons.

Craig

What a laughable argument. Plunder? Breeding poverty? bahahahhahahahahaa Such an unintelligent response deserves nothing but ridicule and pity. THE USA has the HIGHEST STANDARD OF LIVING IN THE WORLD. Morons? Let's see what breeds morons? Liberalism, what great developments are coming out of Europe???? Haiti???? Cuba?????? Venezuela????? Mexico???? Nothing! Squat.

Highest standard of living? You're drinking the kool aid. Dream on . Most of European countries are higher with better health care , more mobility, much more job security , free college , a shorter work week , much better pensions , longer vacations. You can't have the most expensive housing ,health care and spend ten times your nearest competitor on military, have the highest incarceration rate and still have a high standard of living. Wake up and smell the financial meltdown.Google highest standard of living by country.We're a rich man's paradise


Craig

Oh yes, Europeans have single family homes, several cars, cabins in the mountains, 50 inch televisions, home satelites, 1500 plus square foot homes?????? The USA has the HIGHEST STANDARD of living bar none in the World. We had the best health care system in the World until Obama and Pelosi began to destroy it. We're the nation where anyone can work smartly and enjoy the fruits of their labor and genius. Get your head out of that, who knows, induced fantasy.

Oh there you go and let your main objective out; "free" college, "free" health care. FREE FREE FREE. America is the land of Freedom, not Freeloading.

The anonymous comments in this exchange are astonishing in their willful ignorance of policy facts and advocacy for greed and racism.

They don't recall that President G.W. Bush and Alan Greenspan pushed hard for subprime mortgages as a method of increasing "the ownership society".

Banks are not "nameless, faceless institutions". In recent years, they were run by greedy men who were freed up to do damage by conservative politicians and regulatory agencies who tore down rules which prevented banks from investing in risky ways. Bizarre new financial instruments were invented which allowed investment firms to profit on bets that loans would go unpaid and markets would crash. This system meant that many (not us) profited both in the boom cycle and the recent bust, creating no incentive to implement sustainable business practices.

Then there's the bailout of those financial institutions which were chiefly responsible for the crisis. Republicans love to talk about the need to force people to take responsibility for their actions, yet President Bush and Republicans in Congress supported the first, least regulated TARP bailout. Only when the new President took office did Republicans become anti-bailout. At the same time, many conservatives currently defend the right of bailed-out businesses to give their executives ridiculous pay levels after the damage those same CEO's and CFO's caused on Main Street.

The statement that the "government forced banks to give out bad loans to unqualified minorities" is a racist lie. Citizens of all colors and financial classes have become unable to maintain their mortages. Instead, conservatives instituted changes in government policies which gave banks and other mortgage agencies incentives to do so if they wished. The lender made commission money on the loans, and then the loan debt became chopped up into multiple "credit default swaps" and other unsound investment products. This meant that the lender profited whether they were paid back or not.

The anonymous commenter fails to remember the bizarre circumstances homeowners from all regions, rich and poor, have been in recently. Many have sought out the owner of their mortgage only to find out that the original lender has sold the debt, and that there is no primary owner of that debt, leaving these mortgage holders no one to work with in order to negotiate a modification of their loan. This is good policy only in the Randian fantasy world our anonymous commenter lives in.

Two final things in response to the anonymous commenter's entirely false descriptions of the impact of policies of trade, mass transit, health care, education and many other areas.

The recent New York Times story "Despite Signs of Recovery, Long-Term Unemployment Rises" held a quote which neatly summarizes the amoral libertarian's paradise we currently live in. Here goes:

"American business is about maximizing shareholder value", said Allen Sinai, chief global economist at the research firm Decision Economics. "You basically don't want workers. You hire less, and you try to find capital equipment to replace them."

Would "Anonymous" care to defend this business leader's statement? In my view, it has become a nasty, uncaring world we live in when someone thinks it is acceptable to say such things in public.

Finally, "Public transit (is) just another step toward fascism..."? Really? Fascism doesn't mean what Anonymous thinks it means. From Wikipedia:

"Fascism is a radical and authoritarian nationalist political ideology. Fascists seek to organize a nation on corporatist perspectives, values and systems such as the political system and the economy. Scholars generally consider fascists to be on the far right of the conventional left-right political spectrum....Fascists believe that a nation is an organic commnity that requires strong leadership, singular collective identity, and the will and ability to commit violence and wage war in order to keep the nation strong...Fascists reject and resist autonomy of cultural or ethnic groups who are not considered part of the fascist's nation and who refuse to assimilate or are unable to be assimilated. They consider attempts to create such autonomy as an affront and threat to the nation...They oppose liberalism- as a bourgeois movement- and Marxism- as a proletarian movement- for being exclusively economic class-based movements...They believe that economic classes are not capable of properly running a nation, and that a merit-based aristocracy of experienced military persons must rule through regimenting a nation's forces of production and securing the nation's independence."

Avocacy for greed and racsim? No one said any broad statements regarding any single race you psychopath. Big deal if Bush and Greenspan pushed for subprime mortgages, they did it to kiss up to the black and Mexican loud mouths who cry "racist" at every comment and attempt to shake down banks. This was just another feeble attempt by Bush to shut the cry babies up.

You seem to have a selective memory regarding the first bank bailout in the fall of 2008. The people were against it, Conservatives were admantly against it, It was bleeding heart Liberals who pushed it; Obama, McCain, Pelosi, Bush and Paulson who ramrodded that crap through Congress. You seem to forget that Pelosi was the Speaker of the House. Conservatives wanted the weak banks to go under, it was the cry baby's who are always looking to the government for a free ride who wanted the bailout; Pelosi, Reid, Obama. It was Democrats and a few Republicans who passed the bailout. DON'T insult people by saying that the GOP pushed the bailout, they didn't have the numbers in Congress to push it. But, then you're just mouthing the same leftist crap; repeat a lie often enough and soon people will believe it.

It is not a racist lie that banks were forced to give loans to unqualified minorities. The facts speak for themselves. It was the government meddling in the housing market, Barney Frank, loud mouth whiner of Massauchusetts and Chris Dodd, loud mouth whiner of Connecticutt were the main agitators in Congress for funnelling money into that empty hole of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.

New York Times as a reliable source for anything??? bahahhahahaah Don't make me laugh, that rag is going under do to it's biased coverage and America will be that much better without them.

Capital equiptment to replace workers??? Wake up, that's called efficiency and it's been around for years. But, then from you posts it's obvious you have no idea or ability to understand how a modern ecnonomy operates. I'm sure you're lamenting the demise of oil burning lamps because of all those poor Portuguese fishermen who lost their jobs of hunting sperm whales. If you don't have anything intelligent to state, don't post.

A quote from a New York Times article is referenced. You slur the newspaper, then support the premise of the quote. In your world, the Bush Administration, gloried by conservatives as a defender of conservative principles until the inevitable crash came, was doing the bidding of liberals. Bizarre.

I could go on with the rest of your statements, but better to just note that this style of fact-free, hostile argumentation is unpersuasive.

I'd leave it to my fellow readers to decide who is closer to fascism, the Obama Administration or our anonymous commenter.

It's obvious that the Obama Administration is closer to fascism. The GM and Chrysler takeovers, the nationalization of student loans, nationalized health care, "diversity" are all examples of Obama fascism. And considering the personal history of Nancy Pelosi, the conclusion can only be Fascist.

Fascism is something that takes place primarily in the private sector. It's the hierarchy of businesses.The auto industry went to the government for a bail out. students were getting gouged by banks paying exorbitant interest rates something we haven't done to previous generations. Another example of the predatory finance sector. The health care plan was based on Republican models , initially the Senator Chafee model and then the Massachusetts Romney model, with volume discounts for small business.Name calling is a form of infantile fascism but Obama is a brilliant left leaning Democrat.Look up fascist in the dictionary . Obama would have never invited dialogue with Republicans on issues. He would have just called himself the decider.
Craig

You tend to use a cheap white wash over the fascist tendencies of the infantile Obama. It wasn't the Auto Industry that went to the government for a bailout. It was the UAW who went there trying to protect the obscence contracts they had. These idiots from the UAW destroyed Detroit with their ignorance, work rules and pensions. Retiring after 30 years regardless of age. What a load of bullS&^T!!! Students getting gouged by banks??? bahahhahahahahahaa Predatory lending???? I'm busting a gut at the idiocy that is allowed to be posted on the internet. Obama never invited dialouge with the GOP on any issues. He has only seen himself as a "decider". It's his Marxist/Facisct way or not. He has no American qualities, he acts like any half assed 3rd World thug. Which he is anyway.

The obscenity is coming out of your logic.When companies were making lots of money they were still exporting their production out of the country. Check out studentloanjustice.org That's where you'll see obscene salaries among the loan CEO's.If Obama was a Marxist he wouldn't be allowed near the Democratic Party.What you really want to use is the N word, right? I would guess if that hypothetical was remotely true than his economic advisers would be Marxists. Say anything you want , make it up, facts don't matter.It's a free country. Especially since you're anonymous.As Reagan used to say "conservatives believe in God and Marxist believe in man."

Craig

Also calling someone a Marxist/Fascist is like calling someone a big fat skinny person. It's a political term that makes not sense. If you really want to use the N word use it, whoever you are you tall short person you.

Craig

Votes for H.R. 1424, the first "bailout bill", in early October 2008, with four months left in Bush's term:

Senate: 74-25, Republican Senators 34-15
House: 263-171, House Republicans 91-108

This doesn't reflect the statement that "a few Republicans passed the bailout"; the majority of Republicans in Congress did. Everyone's got their fingerprints on it, the good and bad effects of it.

OOOOH the N word. Too offensive to print. Go on and use it. Fred Sanford said it all the time. baahahhahahahahahaha
So if the vote was 74 in favor and 34 were GOP that means that 40 were Democrats!!! bahhahahahaha It took Democrats to pass it. DUH!

Obama is a Marxist and so are his advisers. They're all nothing but academic pinheads who, like Obama, have accomplished nothing in the private sector.

Complaining about loan CEO's making money but not a word about the pigs at Fannie Mae. Oh wait, wasn't Raines a black man??? Oh that must make it OK then.

You need to call him something, why not something insulting. Why not call him an alien from outer space, that's the ticket.Obama is from Mars!!
The people who have betrayed you are the corporate conservatives. If people couldn't qualify for loans why were they given the loans? With a Republican in the White House, Barney Frank was controlling the financial sector and allowing all these loans to unqualified applicants. He can't control the blue dogs on his own committee yet he was dictating that Wall Street make bad loans.
We have strict rules about Marxism in this country. There probably aren't a dozen elected Marxists in the country . I doubt that the leading capitalists in the country would contribute to a Marxist under any situation and Obama got his fair share of donations from Wall Street and corporate America. You just want to use the N word but code it with Marxist gibberish.

Craig

bahahahhhahahahahha N word???? Go ahead and write it out. NUT? NoBama? What is this N word that you're so fascinated about?

The Banks were forced to give loans to unqualified applicants because the GOVERNMENT was forcing them to do it to avoid being labeled "racist". The leading capitalists??? What the hell are you talking about moron, Warren Buffet and George Soros were backing that Marxist Affirmative Action plub Obama. Go back to your "time out" circle.

Another opportunity to deal with factual information, instead of off-base claims that banks were forced to engage in unsound practices. Instead, they were allowed to feed their greed due to regulation rule changes and lax regulation of the rules which remained. From this week's papers:

The LA Times has a preview: Washington Mutual created 'mortgage time bomb,' Senate panel finds

Before Washington Mutual collapsed ... its executives knowingly created "a mortgage time bomb" by steering borrowers to subprime mortgages and turning the loans into securities the company knew were likely to go bad, one of the most extensive investigations into the causes of the financial crisis has found....
"At times, WaMu selected and securitized loans that it had identified as likely to go delinquent" or securitized loans in which the company had discovered fraudulent activity, such as misstated income, without disclosing the information to investors, the committee found. The company's pay practices exacerbated the problem by rewarding loan officers and processors based on how many mortgages they could churn out.

More from the Wall Street Journal: Senate Probe Finds Washington Mutual Ignored Warnings

The documents to be disclosed on Tuesday also reflect that employees routinely fabricated lending documents. "One Sales Associate admitted that during that crunch time some of the Associates would 'manufacture' asset statements …and submit them to the" loan processing center, according to one document. "She said the pressure was tremendous ... since the loan had already [been] funded."

Some would cut and paste data from worthy loan applicants, according to yesterdays hearings involving Washington Mutual.

Craig

And if the banks denied those loans, there would have been the same crying babies; "oh it's racist redlining". The banks were forced to make bad loans, so they attempted to make a profit and it backfired. Oh well, that's how he cookie crumbles. Therefore, the banks and those who took out the loans should lie in the bed they made. No bailouts for either party. Let the chips lay, there are plenty of intelligent people who will pick up the pieces and run with it.

They made the loans so they could bundle them in exotic finance configurations, derivatives, CDS ,CMO's etc. The stuff done on a retail level as mortgages were "small potatoes" compared to what the investment banks were making. Racism had a lot to do with sub primes since many people bambozzeled into sub primes qualified for fix rate mortgages and now we're all paying for that rascism.

CRAIG

No one held a gun to those people's head when they signed on the bottom line. If all these people, of all stripes, qualified for a conventional mortgage then why didn't they? It doesn't take much brains to know and read a simple loan contract. "Oh in 5 years, my mortgage could jump $900 a month? Wow, I better just sell before then huh?"... and the cartoons go "Duuuh Which way do I go George? Which way do I go? duuuuuuuuuuuuuuh"
Manuel

Manuel, see the articles cited above. With lax regulations, bank and mortgage executives instructed their sales staff to steer borrowers toward subprime and Adjustible Rate Mortgages (ARM's). These were attractive to borrowers because of low to nonexistent down payments, low initial interest rates and paltry asset statments. As discussed in the articles, executives incentivized sales with big commissions, with no penalty to any staff if the loan was not paid.

It was not at all evident from these contracts that mortgages could jump $900 a month in future years. The rate of adjustment was not defined in the contract; mortgage sales staff often made irresponsibly optimistic claims that the adjusted interest rates would remain fairly low in future years. Yes, the language was in the contract, but few of us are lawyers or economists.

There used to be a trusting relationship between lenders and lendees. Before deregulation and its resultant "too big to fail" firms, lenders' executives were from the community. They understood it was important to hold the community's cash in a responsible manner; they didn't lend recklessly, they demanded substantial documentation that the borrower was good for the loan, and they told the truth about the risks involved.

With deregulation and lax regulation, sound business practices were no longer necessary if you had no conscience about the consequences of your actions and only cared about making money.

Of course if all anyone cared about was making money and the commissions were high on these ARM's etc. There is going to be a point where it all explodes. But, these people who took out these loans were just as greedy as the salesmen who sold them the product. They had wild dreams of flipping the homes at a high profit in just a few years; oh look this $150,000 house in 1998 is now $350,000 in 2003 this will go on forever? There is equal blame amongst all parties and no one should attempt to claim "babe in the woods".
Manuel

The problem also has something to do with the lack of affordable housing and the big difference between owning and renting. People who own homes are building equity . Renters may be paying close to or as much as people paying mortgages, yet home owners over the long haul end up way ahead of renters. So the pitch to become a home owner is very appealing.
Ultimately the home buyers in subprime mortgages were mostly victims.The sooner we realize this and provide help to subprime borrowers the sooner we'll fix the housing problem.

Craig

There were many motivations and levels of responsibility from the borrowers; it is not wise for any of us to assume that the millions mortgage payers who are defaulting had any one view. It is important to keep in mind that the real estate and mortgage salespeople were the experts on whether the loan was a responsible business deal. Many borrowers are not experts, and could be forgiven if they took the salespeople's word that they could afford the mortgage.

There were certainly real estate agents who were irresponsibly suggesting that home values would continue to climb, and there were others who were more realistic. The problem is that with deregulation the incentive process was extremely flawed, in that making the deal gained the agents and sales associates tremendous financial rewards, but there was not an equal negative consequence if the loan failed, because the debt was hidden in these complicated financial products such as credit default swaps.

So put the blame right where it belongs; on the guy who signed on the dotted line. Put the blame on the jackass politicians who take land out of development, who increase regulations which add dollars onto the price of the homes. Put the blame where it belongs.

It is remarkable how thoroughly we speak past each other. I point out that we just went through a decade of massive deregulation, and the anonymous commenter immediately replies that politicians are to blame for increasing regulations.

At some point factual information simply has to be valued; otherwise, we're just facing off with competing belief systems.

When you use some types of fact then it will be valued until then. You are just using the same Leftist talking points. It doesn't matter what loan product someone was pitched. The ultimate blame goes on the people who signed on the bottom line, they allowed themselves to be duped; by realtors, by mortgage brokers, by politicians. Those who don't understand basic ecnomonics have no one to blame but themselves.
Manuel

Poor people walked away from the bogus loans because they couldn't make the payments . The people who screwed up the economy and ruined the housing market were also the ones who made out like bandits. You don't put foot soldiers on trial for War Crimes, you put the Generals and political leaders. Likewise the people to blame are the bankers, CEO 's and the people who made millions.Conservatives are morally wrong to blame the victims and turn a blind eye to the real criminals , the people who made millions and created misery.Our system is so corrupt , none of theses people are going to jail and there were hundreds if not several thousand "Housing Criminals, guilty of Mortgage Crime."That's a leftist perspective.
Craig

Housing Criminals???? You must mean the Section 8 leeches who steal all the copper and brass from their rentals and sell them. The leeches who don't pay their rent and the politicians who make it difficult to evict these low-lifes. Quit blaming someone who sold a product, blame the idiot who didn't know what he bought.

The criminals are the people who ran multi-billion dollar banking corporations and didn't seem to know that they were making millions in bonuses based on bogus loans. The loan officers who issued loans that were costing people $25,000 and more a year with salaries of $30,000.The buyers were "small potatoes." The investment banks were bundling the loans and making billions. The banks who the bought the loans from were given papers claiming the were AAA rated. The investment banks made billions.They were even making money on betting that the loans would fail.
Everyone knew wages hadn't gone up in decades and that these same consumers were in credit card debt. To top it off the elected officials were swimming in campaign contributions from the finance sector. They now spend over $1 million a day on lobbying to keep the politicians from changing anything.
It's the perfect crime.

Craig

Yeah the perfect crime all perpetrated by Liberal Democrats and their honey boys at Goldman Sachs. Barack Hussein Obama is George Soros' shoe shine.
Manuel

All Republicans support Wall Street. Only half the Democrats do.Obama's a wealthy man in his own right from his book and speech sales. He doesn't need Soros, he raised $750 million almost all of it over the Internet.

Craig

A wealthy man in his own right???? bahahahaha From what? That stupid book. Who is buying it? Bulk sales from unknown sources. He raised $750 million also from unknown sources. No doubt from Comunists, Moslems and yes, George Soros you pinhead. Obama shines some nice shoes.

Yeah Obama hasn't held a position of any responsibility his entire life. One affirmative action position after another. Reminds me of a movie made in the Silent Era.

Right, being President and a U.S.Senator and a state senator aren't responsible position. What planet are you from?Yea I'm sure most of his contributions came from some secret source, a source that was so evil that McCain and Pallin knew about it but were afraid to mention in the campaign.Say anything, it all works.Your motto should be we're not lying we're just trying.

Craig

Obama was placed in the Oval Office, the U.S. Senate and the Illinois Senate by massive voter fraud and corruption. He didn't get it honorably nor ethically. He's an affirmative action plug that's all. He's a blubbering fool who needs to read a teleprompter because he's incapable of rational thought. The only reason McCain didn't make a mention of Obama's ill gotten money was because of the Leftists like Craig who would immediately label any criticism of this minstrel "racist".

You'll never be on my national news program again.hahaha. He also didn't go to Harvard and wasn't the head of the Harvard Law Review. And McCain really didn't graduate at the bottom of his class at West Point and Pallin didn't flunk out of a couple of colleges.I have it all backwards.
Craig

Big Deal! He went to Harvard. On an Affirmative Action Program and the only reason he was head of Harvard Law Review was because he was Black and they put him in there to shut his hole. Again, more Affirmative Action Programs. He wasn't qualified, just placed there because he is Black.

McCain served his Nation in the Navy. We have a record on him. This "noble savage" can't even prove any of his grades; they've been locked up.

Through people like the anonymous commenter, delusional racists are alive and well. This person hates the most vital part of our American way of life, which is democracy.

Faced with a landslide Obama victory, this person rationalizes their unwillingness to accept the will of the American voters through conspiracy theories and untrue claims about Obama and the actions of our government under his leadership. Many of us are disappointed that Obama has been so conservative. We're paying closer attention to what is actually happening, rather than listening to hate talk radio or our own fevered mind.

It's dangerous to play with and promote the idea that your President is not legitimate. The fifteenth anniversary of the Oklahoma City bombing is tomorrow. 168 murdered, 19 children under the age of six.

Democracy? Obama is trying to thwart the will of the American people. If you think Obama is too Conservative then you ma'am are a threat to the American Way of Life. This buffoon has been one dangerous Leftists from the get go.

Oh and before you start with that Oklahoma Bombing stuff ma'am you better point out that McVeigh was hanging out with Moslems in the Phillippines before you start pointing fingers.

Timothy McVeigh told investigators that he was driven to commit mass murder by the Waco, Texas standoff between the Branch Davidians and the ATF. His terrorist attack was intentionally chosen to take place on the anniversary of the end of the Waco siege.

Quotes from McVeigh: "You learn how to handle killing in the military. I face the consequences, but you learn to accept it...Think about the (government workers) as if they were storm troopers in Star Wars. They may be individually innocent, but they are guilty because they work for the Evil Empire...Women and kids were killed at Waco and Ruby Ridge (another violent incident involving Federal law enforcement). You put back in (the government's) faces exactly what they're giving out...Children are fair game; women are fair game."

As he drove toward the Murrah Federal Building in the rental truck packed full of explosives, McVeigh carried with him an envelope containing pages from "The Turner Diaries", a fictional account of white supremacists who ignite a revolution in the U.S. by blowing up a federal building using a truck bomb. He also carried a hand-copied quote from John Locke asserting that a man has the right to kill someone who takes away his liberty.

His self-described motivations had nothing to do with Muslims or the Phillipines at all.

Then why was he in Mindanao? Why did he marry a Filipino?

anonymous is desperate, desperate to avoid McVeigh's own words and actions- why? Tim told investigators exactly why he committed a terrorist act of mass murder.

Avoid McVeigh's own words????? The words of a lunatic is what they are. What was his actions prior to the bombing? That speaks more than the rantings of a lunatic.

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